My Visit to Inteligentry
On August 14, I was able to spend the day visiting the Inteligentry
facility and personnel. Though I went in skeptical, having recently visited with
some frustrated "manufacturers", I came away impressed.
See also below: John
Rohner's Response to 12 Concerns - John sent me his
rebuttals to the 12 concerns I mentioned that I encountered in talking
to some of the "manufacturers" of the Inteligentry engine.
I've posted my responses as well, which indicate my level of
frustration with John.
Shown from left to right: Mark Koppin, Dan
Tana Kane, John Rohner; standing behind the Inteligentry engine and an off-the-shelf 25 kW generator it is designed to run.
(Photo by T.J. There are over 100 available.)
Pure Energy Systems News
Last Tuesday, I was able to spend the day visiting the Inteligentry
facility and personnel. Though I went in skeptical, I came away very favorably inclined.
My trip was covered by a person I met at the TeslaTech
conference, who is interested in licensing the technology. He wishes for his
identity to be anonymous, so I'll just call him T.J. here.
For those of you who might not follow our news regularly, Inteligentry is John Rohner's company, based in Las Vegas. They claim to be in process of bringing a noble gas engine to market.
With very few moving parts, it could potentially (when mass produced) cost a third of what a regular engine of comparable output costs. Meanwhile, its fuel cost is negligible. It's kind of like a Stirling engine -- a sealed system -- except that the expanding component is internal, and comes by way of a plasma form of inert, noble gasses, which are not consumed in the process, and which are environmentally benign anyway.
The expansion of the plasma allegedly moves the
piston in a way similar to how steam does. Known as the "Plasmic
Transition Process" Engine, it is essentially a 3rd generation Papp
engine based on PlasmERG's patented design.
Went in Skeptical
As those of you who follow our news regularly know, I have been generally favorable in my coverage of Inteligentry.
However, I should say that going in to the visit in Vegas, I was in a mindset of strong skepticism, having had the opportunity
recently to speak with some frustrated "manufacturers" of the Inteligentry engines.
To his credit, a few weeks ago, John had given me some contact info for several of his manufacturing groups. I was hoping to be able to go see some engines in the process of being made, as well as to talk to some people who were sold on the technology, having seen it work for themselves.
Instead, what I encountered in talking to some of the people involved in
manufacturing was frustration from:
- No one has seen a working unit.
- The date for being able to see a working unit keeps getting postponed.
- The engines as presently constituted are not well-engineered. John is a
software/hardware engineer, not an engine engineer.
- John's instructions for the engine have come in the form of napkin
drawings (or that ilk), which have had to be converted to professional
- Communication with John has been sparse, hampering progress.
- The engine as presently constituted (per John's specs), by whatever
driving force, couldn't turn at more than 500 rpm for more than a few
minutes without being damaged.
- The Harley Davidson rods being used were designed for a V-approach with
counterbalances, but are being used in a linear approach; and are
synchronous, rather than opposing.
- The engines are not likely to be air-tight to contain the noble gases for
a long duration, especially under pressure.
- Manufacturers have not yet been able to replicate the plasma effect.
- In the past, there have been conflicts/contradictions in how license
territories are being assigned different groups.
- No signed contracts.
- It would seem that the credibility provided by the present engines that
have been built is being used to draw in fresh blood and money to propagate
the operation, when in reality, the engine is essentially non-functional.
That gives you an idea of the weight I was under when I walked through the
doors of Inteligentry on Tuesday. I was expecting that the outcome of my visit was going to be to do an exposι.
As much as I want this company to be for real, I owe it to my readers to let them know when things just aren't what I thought they were.
Lambasted for the Bill and Harry Story
As a few of us gathered around a conference table, the first thing John did
when he walked in was ask me something to the effect (referring to my latest
story: Bill Clinton and Harry Reid allegedly supporting Inteligentry),
"What in the hell do you think you were doing associating me with two
politicians?" He was not pleased with the barrage of emails and comments he
had been getting because of that story, both from the politician haters as well
as the politician supporters.
I reminded him that I had informed him that I planned on publishing my email to
him, which included a link to Bob's account of John's alleged statements about
Clinton and Reid's initial/tentative support of the Inteligentry technology, and
their willingness to send the IRS after Bob and CEI (and my warning him about
the karma that was sure to follow such actions).
John said emphatically that he did not compose that email, but that Bob had
fabricated it, and that no such meeting took place between him and Clinton/Reid.
Based on John's statements to me on the phone about how beneficial it would be
to get support from Clinton/Reid (John doesn't buy into the "conspiracy
theory" that portrays people like Clinton/Reid as being puppets to dark
overlords bent on bringing the planet into world tyranny), I don't know how much
I believe that he did not compose that email to Bob, making up the part about
meeting with them and what they said, just to get a rise out of his brother.
Given the kind of immature bantering that goes on between these two, I
would not put it past John. But I could also believe that Bob did fabricate the
alleged email from John, just to stir things up.
I've seen such behavior over the years between two of my in-laws. They recently
spent $7k on attorney fees fighting over $2k in cash that their mother left when
she died. The older brother had spend most of that on the funeral, and the
younger brother, the perpetual trouble-maker, said that was his money. But
rather than just let it slide, against his attorney's advice, the older brother
spent all that money just to prove he was right. That's one of a score of
equally ridiculous stories I could tell. One is the aggressor and usually the
instigator of ridiculous behavior, and the other is the enabler, feeding the
crazy behavior, spurring more to come.
Having that crazy example to go from, and having seen quite a bit of the emails
back and forth between John and Bob, it seems to me that they are in a similar
pattern, with Bob being the younger instigator, and John feeding the crazy
behavior by not just ignoring it. But how do you ignore it when it gets so out
of hand? Thursday, Bob (and apparently Heinz, too) lodged a complaint with YouTube that all of
were Bob's (including their original videos), so YouTube removed access to all
of them (what ever happened to "innocent until proven guilty"?).
Meanwhile, recall that Bob posted his TeslaTech 2012 presentation against the
copyright rules of that conference. (Story)
In John's defense, I'll say this. Bob told me that John was living high on the
money received from this "scam", having two homes, etc. In
reality, John and his wife Connie are renting a home, and John has no
teeth, choosing to spend his money on the technology rather than on dentists.
That is a fact I saw first-hand -- no teeth. You can't fake that. Bob's
portrayal is absolutely not true on that one. That is one of the biggest
arguments against the "scam" allegation -- the dedication that going
toothless portrays is obvious.
As John laid into me for the Bill and Harry story, I'm glad I bit my tongue for
the most part, because I was right on the edge of fighting back, and that would
have escalated to a termination of my visit. Once he had that off his chest,
John cooled off and was great to be around. Remember, at this initial part of
our visit, I was in that "verge of exposι" mode.
Popper Kits to Ship Soon
Right about then, a UPS shipment arrived, with some samples they had been
expecting for the $350 Popper kit
at the TeslaTech conference in Albuquerque. They received over 100 orders, and
it was clear to me that getting these out was a high priority for them.
These kits supposedly will enable people to see for themselves that noble gas
can be put into a plasma state that can cause a piston to move. If they want an
operational engine, then in the future, they will hopefully be able to get one
from Inteligentry, beginning
December 11, 2012, at the PowerGen
conference in Orlando, Florida.
One of the things holding them back from finishing the kit was that they were
having a hard time finding a good housing for the electronics circuit. I saw
John's face erupted into a big grin as he pulled the casings out of the UPS
packaging and saw that they would fit.
Near the end of the day, another milestone was achieved. John's son, Matt, finished the programming for the circuit board, so now
the ball is in Dan Glover's court to shoot a video showing how to install it on
the popper and run it.
Tour of the Facility
(The blank plate was the rental T.J. had. They were supposed to remedy that the next
As we approached the facility, I was impressed by how nice it looked. I had
been expecting something with more of an industrial look. The hall inside the
10,000 square feet is shaped kind of like a G. They have more than ten office
rooms, so that each of the 10 full-time people on the team has their own room.
The person who has been doing the build-out was working on those as we walked
through. And John's wife, Connie, has a studio room to do her painting. Her
paintings are found on the walls throughout the facility. There are at least two
rooms that will be used for the training on how to build and run the engines.
Near the end of the tour, when we were back in the larger room where several
engines are sitting, John proudly showed us the circuitry they have developed
that will enable the manufacturers to get the right mixture of noble gases to
put into the finished engine.
One thing about noble gasses is that as a mixture sits, it settles.
"That's why the [dormant] engine turns two cycles before it begins
firing," John explained.
Here's some of their equipment:
Lunch Without John
After the tour of the facility, we went to lunch on Inteligentry's treat. John
stayed behind, saying that this is the only way he is able to get to his email
and other ongoing tasks, lest they pile up.
As I rode with Dan Glover to lunch, I began addressing some of the frustrations
that had been communicated to me by some of the manufacturers. Overall, his
response was: "We know; and we're working on it."
Dan sees Inteligentry as being at the pivotal turning point comparable to the
early days of Apple computers, when they went from being Steve Jobs in his
garage largely alone, to having a team working together to bring about Steve's
vision. John is the first to admit that he makes mistakes and needs help of a
team to pull this off.
Dan used to work with a web design team doing MGM Grand's website. He knows the
corporate world, and he loves the contrast he sees with John's team. (And yes,
he's working on a new website for Inteligentry.) He also was a practicing
attorney. He will take the Nevada bar soon. For
him, the excitement of what Inteligentry can become, and the difference it can
make in the world, makes his former job at MGM seem silly in comparison, even
though the pay at Inteligentry is presently small, at least for now. Everyone at
Inteligentry is paid the same: $2500 / month. Clearly, they are not in this for
T.J., Tana, Mark, Dan, and I were at lunch for probably a couple of hours,
talking through all kinds of things, largely having to do with the
manufacturer's frustrations I mentioned above. To the Inteligentry team, none of
the obstacles were insurmountable. In response to the above list, here is the
Inteligentry response as I understand it:
- Not showing a working unit is a key strategy to maintain the
"un-credible" image to keep them under the radar and give them
time to get geared up and ready for the attention that will come to them once
they go public with a working unit in December at the PowerGen conference.
John referred to Bloom
Box as an example. After being quiet, they came out with a big splash
announcement on 60 Minutes, and received a barrage of orders; but it turned
out they had a bug in their system, and they weren't able to fulfill any
orders. Now the bug has been fixed, but the attention has long since passed.
They messed up their opportunity.
- The new target date for manufacturers to get their engines running, with
John's assistance, is a couple of weeks away.
- Now that there is a team helping John, they will be able to help
coordinate the manufacturers working together to come up with a good first
version design for the engine. Mark will be the primary contact for that.
- Now that there is a device design person, Nora, working full-time, a full set
of 3-D drawings should be available soon. She will be coordinating everything that has to do with this.
- Now that the team around John has been brought largely up to speed on
their tasks, they will be able to handle the licensees' communications much
- With the team input, the engine design should be able to be tweaked soon,
to enable a version 1.0 release.
- See 6.
- See 6.
- The release of the Popper kit will also give manufacturers the ability to
replicate and study the noble gas plasma effects.
- The PTP Licensing subsidiary, with Tana and Dan, is now handling all of
- PTP Licensing will be handling the contracts to get them squared away.
- Even without having seen a working device yet, the team has enough
confidence in the concept and in John's abilities, to be willing to take the
risk to be involved in helping this move to its next stage of development.
Working Unit Mentioned on Larry Seyer's Show
When we got back to the facility, I asked John about what he had reported in
recently with Larry Seyer's The
Most Dangerous Device show. In that interview (at 8:23 minutes),
John said that one engine has been running 1 year, 9 months on one fuelling.
T.J.'s and my question for him was, "Where is it, and why can't we (and
Inteligentry team members and manufacturers) go see that one?"
His response was that his contract with that client is such that the client does
not want people traipsing through to see it, and he is going to honor that
contract. He said it puts out 70 kilowatts, continuous. And, he said that
according to their math, it should have stopped running two months ago, but it
On Friday, I asked John: "If you have a unit somewhere that has been
running 1 year, 9 months continuously, outputting 70 kW, that is a majorly
successful scenario. Where are the drawings for that, and why weren't they given
to the present manufacturers to work from?"
Here is his response (slightly edited) :
|From: John Rohner
To: Sterling Allan
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2012 6:16 PM
Subject: Re: Drawings from successful engine?
- The new engine has been evolved to be easy to service and efficient.
- The new engine can auto refuel, on the fly, the older one can not.
- The new engine has a much more sophisticated control system and some extra safety features.
- The old engine is a lab experiment and the new engine is mass producible.
- The old engine weighs 210 lbs the new engine will weigh in at 38 lbs.
- The new engine is meant to grow a business around and the old engine was just to check a lab unit.
Will that be enough or should I add a few more.
Simply put the new engine is a production unit and the old engine was a "lab" unit to provide data for the evolution to a
While improvements can always be made, an engine that runs for 1 year and 9
months continuously on one fuelling seems plenty good to me as a version 1.0
release. I would think that the manufacturers would benefit from seeing the
plans for that device. Surely, it was built from a set of plans.
Here is John's response to that (slightly edited) :
|From: John Rohner
To: Sterling Allan
Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2012 10:44 AM
Subject: Re: Drawings from successful engine?
It was a lab experiment made from welding steel plates together for the
block, and parts from hand drawings. It was not something that was easy to
make in production. It also could not be refilled on the run and they were
not easily reproduced.
There are more engines than you know, working, doing various things. All
are TEST, "LAB"-grade engines that prove one idea or another as
the engine evolved. None were ever considered to be "mass"
produced, so the amount of time and effort to build them was never a
consideration. A production engine must be designed from the first drawing
to be easy to machine, manufacture and produce. You won't make money on a
lab experiment, BUT you get data that gets rolled into patent applications
to protect your ideas as you try them.
Also consider, if you did release something that is not easily
replicated, your whole business goes broke, because you will fail to keep
step with the demand. Production must be easy enough for any company to
do, and do easily, in a way that provides a steady and evolutionary faster
and less expensive engine, without massive engineering investment and
retooling, etc. We have set that standard with "standard"
engines. The engine manufacturers can then take the "standard"
and bend it as they want to anything they want, and they have the
"Standard" engine to provide the cash flow to develop their new
engines, without killing time and their monies to do it.
If we want our manufacturers to be successful, and we do, we must give
them something they can replicate easily as a cash flow floor, to
support their evolution to the next stages, sizes, etc. Providing a
"lab experiment" simply puts them under pressure and drains
their cash, slowing them from providing the volumes needed to make the
engine viable. Keep in mind that two years down stream they will need to
be producing nearly 35 million engines a year. There are 87 million
Combustion engines made now a year.
So we have spent our time getting the best, easiest, reproducible
sample available to help support them so they can be successful and get
the needed growth to actually have some effect on our world.
at the Top of the World
When we arrived at the Inteligentry facility, T.J. offered to take the
entire crew and their spouses (if they had one) to dinner at the Stratosphere,
where he and I were staying. Most of the crew, including John and Connie, have
never been to the Top of the World restaurant. It rotates once every hour and
twenty minutes, 800 feet above ground, with a skydiver jumping every ten minutes
We arrived at 7:00 pm, and were there for three hours. So we got to see the sunset and the Vegas lights. The meal presentation and flavor was amazing.
Besides the jovial conversation and joking we did, probably my favorite part of
the evening was when John and Connie described how each of the ten team members
showed up, as if sent from the angels, with just the right talents. They seem to
get along well with each other, too.
When the check for the meal arrived, I took a quick glance, and I think it
was around $1600 for the sixteen of us. T.J. didn't seem to mind. He was pleased
to see the Inteligentry team enjoying themselves, with some of the spouses meeting
the team for the first time, in this setting.
The next day, after dropping me off at the airport, he bought stock and two
licenses. He hopes his group can have lots of product ready for the December 11
launch. They are certainly capable.
P.S. John's Response to the 12 Points
John gave the following in response (slightly edited) to the twelve points
above. John's responses to the points are in (parenthesis). My comments,
following his, are in [blue brackets; posted Aug. 19; 1 pm
Dan Glover talks to Sterling
From: John Rohner
To: Sterling Allan
Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2012 1:04 PM
Subject: Re: Story: My Visit to Inteligentry
Well I can bet I know who these came from as I know these people all personally.
Here are your points and my counter points.
- No one has seen a working unit. (Maybe, even if they had,
they could not discuss it!) [If anyone should be
entitled to see a functioning unit -- confidentially -- it should be
the manufacturers. Even if no one is allowed to visit the working engine by contract, due to the customer not wanting lots of visitors, I can't see why it could not have been videotaped showing that it runs and what the output is.
- The date for being able to see a working unit keeps getting
postponed. (They were supposed to have 2 engines each, ready 2
weeks after the last meeting; and these were going to be assembled by
them run for them. They never showed, now 4 months later). [Obviously,
at least one group has been productive, since there are 5 engines on
display there at Inteligentry, as shown in photos we've been provided
for a few months.]
- The engines as presently constituted are not well-engineered.
John is a software/hardware engineer, not an engine engineer.
(Interesting, since we have been told by many mechanical engineers,
and their magazines, about how good our design is.) [Brownnosers?
That's not the sentiment I'm getting from the comments, etc. And the
unit you had on a test jig (not running unit) there in your shop was wobbling
significantly even at a low speed.]
- John's instructions for the engine have come in the form of
napkin drawings (or that ilk), which have had to be converted to
professional renderings. (This is also interesting since all were
given 3D drawings, and in some cases 3D plastic prints, as you can see
from our web site; and we even provided machined blocks and complete
bottom ends. They made head rings, head, piston and cylinder ONLY.
First round, and we provided bottom ends and castings for their
current overdue engines.) [I saw the plans one
group was given recently, and they were definitely inadequate.]
- Communication with John has been sparse, hampering progress.
(Again interesting, as anyone that has ever called here can attest. I
talk to everyone. BUT! not my own manufacturers?) [Speaking
for myself, I have a hard time getting in touch with John. It's not
impossible, but it's not easy.]
- The engine as presently constituted (per John's specs), by
whatever driving force, couldn't turn at more than 500 rpm for more
than a few minutes without being damaged. (Interesting, I presume
this is conjecture if number 1 is true. How would they know? However
the engine has no such limitation, and is very stable. Sounds like BS
to me.) [There are many ways to test an engine,
using alternative rotation sources, such as a drill, etc. That's why I
used the phrase "whatever driving force".]
- The Harley Davidson rods being used were designed for a
V-approach with counterbalances, but are being used in a linear
approach; and are synchronous, rather than opposing. (Don't know
what this means, as it is true, the Harley is a V, and we are opposed;
but a local engine shop has verified we are balanced by the counter
weight, as we should be, and all crankshafts are.)
- The engines are not likely to be air-tight to contain the noble
gases for a long duration, especially under pressure. (Another
interesting point from someone that evidently thinks that a chamber
that maintains the same volume in operation and is at the same
pressure as the outside will somehow build up pressure and leak. I
guess they missed the sealing the engine part of the build too.) [The
net pressure at rest might be 1 atm; but if you have a piston flying
back and forth, there is no way the pressure stays at 1 atm. It will
go through compression and decompression wildly, and gases will want
to escape, and come in. I can't fathom how an engine could keep its
gas mixture. Smaller elements (e.g. helium) will leak the most; the
ratio will not last. That's what I would expect.]
- Manufacturers have not yet been able to replicate the plasma
effect. (Was not aware that anyone had tried. Maybe that explains
why they have not supplied engines to us as they are too busy trying
to "copy" it without our controller? There are things they
have not been told. So if they try and copy it, I can understand it
not working. No controller no worky!, as well.) [If
you don't want people replicating the core effect just so they can see
it works, why then are you selling the Popper kits? I don't see
anything wrong with manufacture's wanting to confirm that effect. It's
not a matter of them trying to work around you, it's a matter of them
wanting to have validation that they are involved in a viable
technology, since you've not let them see a working engine.]
- In the past, there have been conflicts/contradictions in how
license territories are being assigned different groups. (Wow,
licensing has not changed in almost 2 years, so I can't say I
understand this comment either. We did have to drop the state license
when the "Tea Baggers" killed the "Farmers Energy
independence" Initiative. And we did add a "Masters"
engine manufacturing license, which these are all, to fill the gap
between people wanting to use engines and the lack of people wanting
to build them.) [It seems you are in denial.
Good luck to your team in sorting through the many contradictions in
territories and terms.]
- No signed contracts. (This is certainly an interesting
statement. At the first Manufacturers meeting, all 3 manufacturers
present were given licenses, signed by me AND stock. All of our master
engine manufacturers are stockholders. ALL have signed Licenses. At
our next manufacturers' meeting, now reset back a week due to some
personal conflicts by some manufacturers with the old date, [any] that
do not have signed licenses will get them, and a copy of the license
is posted online that can be downloaded any time.) [It's
your word against multiple manufacturers that say otherwise. I'm sure
they'll be glad to have this rectified.]
- It would seem that the credibility provided by the present
engines that have been built is being used to draw in fresh blood and
money to propagate the operation, when in reality, the engine is
essentially non-functional. (Well, if they think this then they
need to contact us and we will reclaim their license and provide it to
some "Fresh" blood that will get things done on time and
without trying to copy it, or do understand manufacturing and how
machine tools work etc. It is true we have expanded the original 5
regions into more because we lost faith in our original or lost one or
another, manufacturers. We now plan to provide this same license to
any company that can prove they can do the work and have the needed
engines in stock by the Dec 11 deadline. We are 4 months behind
because of depending on such a small group; and that, plus the
inactivity, or inability, of one of our people to perform it is so. If
you wish to challenge the functionality, come to PowerGen. Or in their
case, get done what you agreed to do, before we cancel your license
and stock. We are tired of being held back.)
I hope this gives some info and better answers. I do know where these
remarks came from. Except I have no clue who would be crazy enough to
"copy" the engine and hope to run it without the proper control,
which no one but us has and even electronic like coils etc. That one does
bother me as it means one of the 4 is Planning to break their word and can
not be trusted. [Their wanting to replicate the core
effect should not be seen as evidence that they want to work around you,
as mentioned above for point 9 above. They have never wanted to go around Inteligentry. All
they want and have ever wanted is confirmation of the phenomenon. They have had many discussions within
their groups that even if they did come up with our own version or an improvement to the process,
they would turn this over to the Inteligentry group as part of their information sharing agreement.]
Stock v. License
Aug. 21; 9 am MDT postscript
I was impressed in two things regarding the licenses: 1) their low price, not
preventing entry; 2) that the license funds are put into escrow until the
licensee witnesses a working unit. Puts you at ease, right?
However, it turns out that PTP Licensing
has a "deal" for stockholders, that for a certain amount of stock, you
can get a license included. That way, they get spendable money.
Furthermore, I've seen them move their "we won't be selling any more stock
after x date" deadline several times. It's that feeling of "purchase
now or you'll loose out on this opportunity."
The following was received by email:
Machinery has all kinds of ways to wear-out and fail. Experience is the
best teacher towards discovering the weaknesses in a design. That is why in
the course of developing a product there will be many intermediate devices built
that work to some level or another. Less than four months before retail
sale, there should have been many engines run through burn in under load.
There is no evidence that Inteligentry's location has a single fixture capable
of testing an engine at load, much less many.
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