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http://pesn.com/2012/05/18/9602094_Genesis_Self-Sustaining_Generator_Prototype_and_Documentation_Pops_up_on_Ebay/
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2012 |
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Genesis Self-Sustaining Generator Prototype and Documentation Pops up on
eBay
Remember the G-Cell by Genesis World Energy back in 2003 that had
everyone excited, curious, mad? The company founder, Patrick Timothy Kelly ended
up in jail for fraud. Well, the demonstration unit is now up for sale on eBay.
Bid closes in a few hours, on May 18, 5:48:41 GMT, with opening bid requested at
$2500.
By Sterling
D. Allan
Pure Energy Systems News
Key Links:
- eBay
listing "Hydrogen Powered Generator - Self Sustaining - Prototype, and Documentation - NR"
- Genesis
World Energy - our index page of coverage on this from 2003. You
might catch some of the broken links from the company website via http://Archive.org
- (I've copied the entire eBay listing, complete with photos, so we can
recreate the listing, if needed.)
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Back in 2003, we never got a look inside.
The eBay listing shows many photos.
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Brief History
Nine years ago, there was a technology that was all the buzz in free energy
circles, known as the G-Cell, or "the box", by Genesis World Energy,
or Genesis Scientific, and eventually changed to United Fuel Cell Technologies. We
tracked it quite closely over at FreeEnergyNews.com.
Supposedly, it would produce enough power to run a house, running on water,
electrolyzed to hydrogen, to run a fuel cell, in a self-powering arrangement,
while drawing energy from the environment in the process.
We never got a look "under the hood." All we saw was the case.
The eBay listing is the first time we're getting to see this perspective.
Jon Got it from an Idaho Auction
I phoned the eBay seller, Jon, on the evening of May 15 to ask him about this.
He said that there are no "plans" included in the extensive paperwork,
but that it does include step-by-step instructions of how to demonstrate
it.
He bought it less than a month ago from a trustee of the former company, via an
online auction.
He spent some time trying to track down the inventor or other principal players
to let them know he had the unit, but he couldn't locate any of them.
Jon thought it looked like everything needed is there, including a reverse
osmosis unit to treat the water prior to it going into the system.
Being an experimenter himself, he bought it for a water torch, and "spent more money than I had planned
on," but after getting it realized it was much more complicated than he had
anticipated.
"It looks like everything is there."
"If it's for real, then it's worth an incredible amount of money."
(And in the listing he asks for 5% royalties on any proceeds if/when it goes
commercial.)
The documentation includes a lot of names in it, of former investors, etc.
As far as he could tell, as the hydrogen goes back to water, they somehow
collect electricity from it, though not as a normal fuel cell, but possibly
involving a clean nuclear reaction.
The unit is called "the cube" in the documentation.
"It's a monster H generator or it could be a whole lot more."
As far as Jon can tell, there are no patents on the technology, and any claims
to such by the company were bogus.
The "Delaware corporation" was never incorporated.
Claims of machines that they were building and shipping, weren't being built and
shipped.
"It's a beautiful design. High quality. There was some money spent on this for sure."
It's about 2.5-feet cubed in size.
A Working Technology Promoted by Fraudsters?
One thing that is very clear about this situation is that the people running
the company were running a scam, but it could be that they had a legitimate
technology at the core of the scam, which they were milking through exaggeration
and lies about capabilities, patents, licenses sold, units sold, etc.
The question is just how valuable the core technology actually was. Was it a
dud that they were trying to oversell, or was it a diamond in the rough that
they were clueless about? Where did they get it? Who is the true inventor?
We've seen this phenomenon of bona fide technology being stolen and exaggerated
many times before:
- Mike Brady and his Perendev magnet motor, which was pirated from a
Brazilian inventor and patent.
- Carl Tilley and the TUV.
- The Johnson Magnet Motor plans presently being sold widely around the web
Working but not Practical?
Another question that should be asked is, "Even if it is a legitimate
technology in terms of actually working, is it a cost-effective, efficient,
clean, feasible technology?"
It could be that it might work but that its component cost, instability,
difficulty of installing, rarity of certain components, or other factors could
render it impractical as a marketable device.
Somewhere in our deliberations about this technology, the view was expressed
that this technology is probably outdated; and current research in this field is
far superior; so why bother with this one.
Much Better Stuff Being Developed Now?
As we at NEST did some due diligence in checking around about the technology,
here is one of the comments that came in from an open-minded physicist:
In summary, do not buy it.
The pictures of the generator are detailed and show a bunch of hydrogen
electrolysis cells. My question is this, are the cells still
functional? They could be contaminated with something that reduces
or inhibits their functionality meaning they would all have to be rebuilt
with new membranes. Assuming the opened line could be reconnected
directly, like, no stripped threads on the fittings. I would be
suspicious of the generator because it is not currently in working order.
Now the big suspicion: The generator is not opened up to see the
interior so we cannot see the conversion technology. So, I went to
the http://www.ion-power.com/products.html
products website. And there I downloaded the attached PDF file.
It shows some of the "additional" equipment that comes with the
unit. From the data sheet it appears that the enclosed box just
contains a/several hydrogen fuel cell(s) that will just convert the
hydrogen back to electricity, less conversion losses. Now, someone
may have used a trick or two to get it to work at a couple of volts but
the work function to break down H2O is fairly low anyway.
So, in summary, I think there was some kind of scam in play and the unit
just makes hydrogen gas from water and then combines the hydrogen with
oxygen in a fuel cell to make low voltage electricity, less conversion
losses. And that would lead to a net loss of power and energy.
And then to top it off there is great suspicion raised by the contents of Free
Energy Link. I see little doubt that there was fraud and if the
device worked it would be worth hundreds of millions more than he
defrauded the investors.
In summary I just do not see anything there so I recommend don't buy it.
If you really wanted a bunch of those hydrogen separator cells, I would
recommend offering maybe $500 for the frames and plumbing realizing that
you may need to disassemble everything and replace all the membranes. |
Four Amish Friends Just Visited Jon
On May 15, four Amish men (not Orthodox) from Pennsylvania arrived to visit
me here in Ephraim, Utah, having driven cross country in a Prius. They're
seeking a technology that is close to being ready to go to market to get involved
with helping bring it forward.
That night, when I got the email telling me about the eBay auction, I forwarded
it to them, thinking they might find it interesting.
We talked again the next morning, weighing the pros/cons (literal); and overall
they thought the photos portrayed a likely legitimate technology, which
unfortunately had been taken over by a fraudulent business. Considering the low
cost of the bid, they thought it would be worth a trip up to Oregon to check it
out in person before purchasing.
That is why I postponed doing a story on this. I didn't want to see any kind of
bidding war take place among people who should be working together on this.
The Amish guys are all for open sourcing, and that is what they would do after
figuring out how it works. I told them that we at the
New Energy Systems Trust (NEST) would gladly help in the process, to helping find people to figure out if there are still any intellectual property
claims to it, figure out how it works, reverse engineer it, draw up plans,
disseminate those. etc.
They headed out later that day and were in Boise by that night.
I just got off the phone with them around 9 pm MDT, May 17, and here is what
they reported, briefly:
The unit is very sophisticated. It won't be easy to figure out.
It looks like there are a couple of key components missing. There is another unit, a mixer unit that mixes the gas (oxygen and water, into correct
ratios), that is not with unit.
It uses a solar panel to make part of the electricity, which makes it dependent
on solar availability for functionality, so far as base load power capability is
concerned.
It requires an oxygen tank.
"If you have someone that wants to bid on it, we're not going to stand in their way."
If no one bids, then Jon has an alternative plan: someone he knows to turn loose on it to develop it.
The documentation includes certificates of people and companies that put money
into this. "We added it up, and it came to over 40 million dollars."
"Their names are there, everything is there.
"There's no reason that he [Patrick Timothy Kelly] shouldn't have it out and running if he just operated it correctly."
There aren't going to be very many people that will understand what is going on
with this unit. You'll probably need an open-minded physicist.
There are essentially two halves of the unit. On half involves pulling
electricity off hydrogen to go into the other box [where it is used in a fuel
cell?].
"There's a lot of research that needs to be done to get this running. We're
more looking for technologies that are ready to go."
What Would I Do?
If money were not an restraint, I would be inclined to procure this and open it
up in an open source project to see if we could resurrect it, reverse engineer
it, assess its potential feasibility, determine if its IP is clear; and if all
those things checked out, then open source it to market.
There are plenty of ways to generate revenue streams in open source projects,
the most obvious being to request a royalty on all commercial applications.
I would also want to try and track down the true inventor or his heirs, an share
that royalty with them.
If You End up Winning this Bid
I hope, if you are the one who ends up winning this bid, that you will consider
working with NEST to open source this, along the lines that I've described here.
And even if you don't want to open source it, we at NEST would be glad to help
you locate the various resources (talents, funds, tools, etc.) to bring it to
market, if it is feasible.
Feel free to contact us and count us in on the project.
Status
The bid ended at 11:48 pm MDT with 0 bids. I don't know if Jon is going to
re-list it. See archive.
Forum Created
Contact
Jon McIntire lists his phone number on his eBay listing: 541-410-5658
# # #
This story is also published at Examiner.
See also
Resources at PESWiki
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Page posted by Sterling
D. Allan Nov. 15, 2006
Last updated June 07, 2012
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